Chinatown Brasserie
If you google, "Food people together" you'll get over ten million results. This is scientific proof that food is supposed to bring people together. If you don't believe me, go ask a ninja about food. Much can be said about what kind of food is good enough to bring people together. Restaurants close all the time, and we can say their failing is the inability to bring people together (for their food). Conversely, if much can be said about the food, much can be said about the patrons as well. Those who visit hole-in-the-wall dumpling places like cheap, filling, and fast food. Those who sit down at Ko want creative, inspired, and delicious food. As a Chinese-American, I have only had non-PC opinions when I see supposedly good Chinese restaurant that is lacking in Chinese patrons. It just always bugs me.
I never understood how good (read: expensive) Chinese food in the U.S. fails to bring Chinese people together. If you believe Ed Levine then Chinatown Brasserie has the best dim sum in Manhattan. This past weekend I went, and I have to agree that Chinatown Brasserie serves great dim sum. But if you love dim sum at reasonable prices, this place will leave you greatly disappointed.
Yes, the food here is top notch. The turnip cake have a crisp exterior that almost no other dim sum place in NY achieves. The shrimp dumplings are delicate and the shrimp is flavorful. The roast pork buns were probably the best I've had in the city. But I will NEVER recommend anyone go here because you're not supposed to be able to eat $30 dollars worth of dim sum and not feel full here. And you can eat 30 dollars worth of dim sum here because the cheapest dish is $6 dollars. No, that's not a typo. SIX dollars. If food can bring people together, why doesn't expensive dim sum bring Chinese people together here in NY?
There was an article in the WSJ about hipness of Chinesefood. And a subsequent discussion on Serious Eats In the article the reporter goes to places in Flushing that are frequented by other Asians. It seems that what qualifies as 'good' Chinese food mostly exist outside of Manhattan. And the best ones in Manhattan? They get no love. I'm not sure what hip Chinese food is really or whether that is possible. But what is 'hip' anyway?
Does 'hip' have to exist in a part of town that trendy people like to go? I think it's great that we have neighborhoods like Flushing and neighborhoods like The Meatpacking District. This way, when I want good Chinese food (by NYC standards) I can go to one neighborhood. And when I want to see the highest per capita of silicon boobies + douchebags, then I can go to the other. See? New York works itself out. Different people choose where they want to go and whether they want to mingle with other groups.
Ed Levine loves Chinatown Brasserie and thinks Jin Fong is "less than mediocre" but where do Chinese people eat at? I've seen Chinatown Brasserie on a Sunday at 12 noon and Jin Fong Sunday at 12 noon... it ain't even close. Of course the reason for the disparity in number of customers is mostly financial... $3 dollar dim sum somehow tastes better than $6 dollar dim sum if you aren't rolling in it. So is CB more hip because they attract a higher yearly income demographic? Or is Jin Fong more hip because it's PACKED every Sunday? Or is a restaurant hip when the likes of Bruni and Levine descend upon it and deem it 'delicious'?
I would define a 'hip' Chinese restaurant as a busy Chinese restaurant in a trendy part of Manhattan that is frequented by ethnic Asians and Caucasians alike. If Joe Ng's great dim sum cannot bring Chinese people together, and the mediocre dim sum at Jing Fong cannot bring foodies together, then maybe we should all just eat what we want and call it hip. And damn the WSJ to hell and back for saying the food of my people ain't all that here in New York? Poopy pants on you WSJ and guess what? It is ON like Donkey Kong! Well, maybe not, but I need to go find some chicken feet...
Chinatown Brasserie
380 Lafayette St .
New York, NY 10003
212-533-7000
I remember Jing Fong when it used to be smaller and on a different street and quite a bit tastier. But this was over 20 years ago when I was a wee little tyke, well not that little lols. Jing Fong now is definately not even close to mediocre even in Asian standards. I believe people, mainly Asians, go there because the place is so big and fairly low in prices. It's not even the cheapest either, but the pure size of the place is incredible. Most Chinese families associate dim sum or yum cha as a socializing event where you sit down with family to have brunch on sunday mornings and most of the time, the adults are reading the newspaper! I don't know why people like to compare dim sum places with Jing Fong, I personally like to goto Ping's on Mott street. But the truth is, Manhattan dim sum places are not remotely close to what it used to be like when I was growing up. I kinda miss it....
wonders
September 11, 2008 11:28 am
Sorry, didn't mean to write a speech -=X lols
wonders
September 11, 2008 11:33 am
So I saw the articles on Chinese food being hip or not and I didn't get it either. Who the f* cares if it's "hip" - whatever that means - provided it tastes good? I want food to taste good, and if it doesn't have street cred or something... well, so be it.
Unfortunately, as a fellow Chinese American, I would be less than thrilled to pay $6+ a dish for dim sum because I know I can get it just as delicious somewhere else for cheaper. Ping's on Mott is alright but it gets super crowded.
I've been thinking about Blondie's posts lately and now with your post, I kind of want dim sum, but I'm not that big of a dim sum person because... sadly... I only ever go with my family really and that's not a frequent occurrence. I was going to suggest a food blogger meet up dim sum (not sure if you & Blondie actually know each other or not, I don't know either of you) but it can be hard to have this kind of "family style" meal with people you don't really know. I find it hard to have dim sum with my friends, even, because some people are allergic and we all have different tastes for what we like (me: tripe, shrimp "rolls", phoenix claws, ooh! fried crullers in rice noodle!, and more...), and I'm not keen on eating all of that by myself...
Oh, I thought of something else. Most of the places that my family likes for dim sum will have a dearth of non-Asian tables or people, with one or two scattered here and there, looking uncomfortable amongst their Asian counterpart's family. Most of these same places do not cater to the non-Asian population, and it can be very intimidating to be a non-Asian in that sort of place. I find it intimidating because I LOOK Asian, but when I'm approached and Chinese is spoken fast at me, I blank out and freeze, then they think I'm an idiot... I don't know. It would be hard, in that instance, to infiltrate the really good places, which do plenty of bus
Yvo
September 11, 2008 12:40 pm
Your site totally cut me off but didn't tell me I was being cut off. I hope you have the rest of my comment somewhere :(
Yvo
September 11, 2008 12:41 pm
Wonders,
You know that's interesting you mention Chinese families. A friend of mine told me dim sum is not peasant food. But it certainly is a GROUP food. It attracts people to come together. You see so many large groups at dim sum. And thanks for the idea of Ping's!
Yvo,
First, sorry my site cut you off. I never expected anyone who'll need more than 1500 characters of space... I'll update that tonight to fit more and add a blurb so people know. Maybe a counter or something.
My friend was saying if it's 6 dollars, it better be three times as delicious. haha. You and him are both right in that there's other good food to be enjoyed. There's no reason to pay $6 dollars!
And there are non-Asians at Jing Fong. I don't feel like they cater nor do other dim sum places. There is no reason to cater to anyone really. If you make stuff that a huge group of people enjoy forget about a few stragglers who might not like it. Although that might also be part of the 'hip' thing.
Danny
September 11, 2008 2:03 pm
LOVE dim sum. But also totally agree with wonders that it may be the activity as well as the food that I love. I find it relaxing.
PS. I too used to eat at Jing Fong many moons ago before it exploded in size and I moved away. >sigh<
Jonathan
September 11, 2008 4:34 pm
i went to chinatown brasserie once at dinnertime and it was like a ghost town. empty. yeah, there were no people getting together over there.
as for the food, i didn't think anything was really that much better than chinatown. i mean, does sticking two little eyes on a dumpling make it taste better? not for me.
bionicgrrrl
September 11, 2008 5:11 pm
Oh can I please go eat dim sum with you two?!!! Please!!! I promise to behave and not make any lewd comments or innuendos!! I'm not allergic to anything and you can say "Blondie, eat this," since I don't know what anything is, so I will eat it. And yes, it is very intimidating for a non-Asian who doesn't know anything to walk into Asian-ful places, and I'm sure vice versa. Hence my food journey now where I'm more informed of the menus and what they contain than I was 4 or 5 years ago.
Blondie
September 11, 2008 9:47 pm
here's an interesting op ed by the Zagats, about Chinese food in America.
http://www.nytimes.com/2007/06/15/opinion/15zagat.html
Traditional Chinese food is meant to be enjoyed in a family style, regardless of whether you're eating dim sum or Sichuan stir fry. But part of the enjoyment of dim sum is the experience of picking things off of a cart that comes full of choices. Does CB do that? Or do you have to order the food?
I wonder how Indian people feel about Indian restaurants like Tabla. What about La Taqueria vs. Dos Caminos. Although, I suppose you could argue about whether or not Tabla and Dos Caminos are authentic.
Ang
September 11, 2008 10:52 pm
"I was going to suggest a food blogger meet up dim sum, but it can be hard to have this kind of "family style" meal with people you don't really know."
Yvo- germs are good for you! Embrace them.
I'm in. I'll gladly eat any food touched by Danny or Blondie. As for the Dim Sum argument, comparing Jin Fong to Ping's is futile. One is small, one is big. Quality vs. variety. I personally like big places, with more variety. None in NY are as good as you'll find on the West coast. World Tong is Brooklyn is the only place I've ever been to in NY that balances variety and quality really well.
zach
September 12, 2008 9:11 am
Those are really nice dim sum photos, and your post was super interesting! Sorry I haven't been to the places you blogged about so I can't blog on them (I'm always off-topic)!) I eat dim sum all the time (at least once per week but often more). Here in HK you can find dim sum at every price point. I've had dim sums on a stick off a cart, and also dim sum served with sliced abalone and bird's nest with edible gold leafs mushed on top. There are good/bad dim sum across the board, but it's funny to think of dim sum places as "hip" or not hip. In fact, I guess the few places that would be considered "hip" are sort of fusion-y or gimmick-ally traditional. We love our dim sum. If the pork bun is good, we'll be there, as proven by packed dim sum restaurants everywhere.... When I studied Food History in university (best elective ever), it was interesting to see dim sum culture analyzed so intensively. It is a chance for socializing/ getting together, but at the end of the day, it's cuz the food is good! Almost all Chinese cuisines are shared family style (so weird to see foreigners ordering their own individual dish). Dim sum is definitely a lunch/brunch thing.
I must say I get really hungry every time I come on your blog :)
Veronica
September 12, 2008 11:32 am
World Tong is super yummy, but gets really really crowded on weekends.
wonders
September 12, 2008 12:19 pm
Zach - do we not remember my post on Lupa, our meal that only parts of were served family style and I politely wrote about having to put my fork into the same dessert as the guy sitting next to me... who thankfully wasn't sneezing or coughing or anything =P
Danny - I am extremely VERBOSE. With me as a newly frequent commenter, please up the count to 3,000 words or more, especially when you post a question like this that MUST be answered!
PS - Family's current fave dim sum place is in GREAT NECK. Still in, Zach? :P
Yvo
September 12, 2008 5:01 pm
"The roast pork buns were probably the best I've had in the city."
Better than the baked bun at Mei Lai Wah?
Dennis
September 12, 2008 7:21 pm
Jonathan,
It really sounds like Jing Fong used to be the place to go. *sigh*
bionicgrrrl,
Yea I'm kind of surprised that they can keep Chinatown Brasserie open for so long if it's ghosttown for much of the time.
Blondie,
No lewd comments or innuendos? Well okay then!
Ang,
Yea I wonder about the authenticity of Mexican food. You think Mexican cuisine blends into American culture more? I get that feeling.
Zach,
Ahh.. World Tong. I remember that at post on Midtown Lunch. Mmm... chicken feet... I wonder if that's too far for the other folks...
Veronica,
Glad you like the pictures! You're spot on when you say that it's always a family style gathering. And yea, at every price point, there will be good and bad. Sometimes you just wish for the impossible, good food and great prices!
Yvo,
Oh man, Great Neck? I don't even know where that is!
Dennis,
Ooops, I should have clarified. They have the best STEAMED roast pork buns. Mei Li Wah actually makes a mediocre version of the steamed bun because of the actual bun they use. It's not the traditional kind associated with roast pork buns. Baked buns, Mei Li Wah is still amazing!
Danny
September 14, 2008 10:18 pm
I know this post is really late compared to when you blogged about dimsum. But I couldn't resist letting you know that the chef at Chinatown Brasserie started out at a local dimsum restaurant in Brooklyn near my house in Dyker Heights! He used to come out and observe his patrons. My family and I were regulars because his food was so good. This place was packed all time. And by asians! The price was not the $6 kind. It was more of the $2.50 kind. When he left the joint, we were all disappointed since the food had fallen below par. We no longer patron that restaurant. But I found out that he's the chef at Chinatown Brasserie because he did a segment about his new restaurant on TV. I recognized him right away. It's too bad that he's so far away at an expensive restuarant. He's very talented.
Heidi
November 21, 2008 3:51 pm